7th October 2019 at 2:41 pm #496987th October 2019 at 2:54 pm #497017th October 2019 at 5:01 pm #49715AnonymousInactive366 pts
For me, I think Klopp is the best manager in the world right now. I’m biased of course but I will say that it’s his time at City that has truly convinced me of Peps quality. He didn’t just inherit a brilliant team and coast, he brought them up multiple levels. His 101 point side is the best every PL team, I’ve no doubt in my mind about that.
To compare the managers statistically, it would seem pretty one-sided, as Pep has won a lot more than Klopp but for me, Klopp takes the more difficult projects and he even won the Bundesliga 2 times (against Pep’s Bayern). I just think it’s a lot harder to take a team that wasn’t really in contention and to them win a title, or make the CL final etc etc. I definitely wouldn’t want to get into a heated debate with anyone about it though because I still think it’s pretty close. These clearly are the best 2. They have both created ridiculously good teams and to say that one is better than the other is not to take anything away from the other.
Our opinions may have a few seasons left to change our minds also. I guess a lot of it might come down to whether Klopp can win the PL in his time at Liverpool…. ,As for Pep going to Utd. I’d break down and cry.7th October 2019 at 5:05 pm #49718
Mak-I agree 100%.7th October 2019 at 5:11 pm #49720AnonymousInactive11 pts
I agree with most of that mak. I always said I can see Klopp doing what Pep has accomplished at City, but I cannot see Pep ever doing what Klopp has done at Liverpool. He would not have the resources and financial backing to do so.7th October 2019 at 5:19 pm #49723LuckydestinyBlocked110 pts
Mak, not to detract from your argument but neither of Klopps Bundesliga titles were won while Pep was at Bayern. In fact Pep won the title in all 3 of his seasons there. I cant split them myself but lean slightly towards Klopp.7th October 2019 at 5:34 pm #49726nine nine nineModerator849 pts7th October 2019 at 6:03 pm #49727
9-Just wait til Wenger takes over United,does a Sunderland with us,bankrupts us,then we`ll talk.
7th October 2019 at 6:48 pm #49729PaganParticipant298 pts
- This reply was modified 4 months, 3 weeks ago by maverick1973.
Pep and Klopp, although successful managers have a different pedigree.
Pep has been successful at Barca, Bayern and City, however all three of these teams had won their domestic leagues at least twice in the five seasons preceding him taking over.
Klopp, may not have quite the trophy collection of Pep, but with Dortmund and Liverpool he has taken over teams without a league title in a decade or more.
Make of that what you like, but to me it would seem if you want a successful team to keep being successful Pep’s your man, if you need to build a team then it’s Klopp…..Pagan7th October 2019 at 6:51 pm #49730nine nine nineModerator849 pts
Good summary Pagan.7th October 2019 at 6:52 pm #49731PaganParticipant298 pts
C67, to be honest I don’t think Ferguson left when he wanted, he left when he knew he had to. Ferguson ruled with a rod of iron, once player power got a foot in the door at Man U his days of ruling by fear were over. You have to credit him for what he achieved and knowing when his time was up…..Pagan7th October 2019 at 9:12 pm #49732
Pep will honour his contract, he has even stated he may ask for an extension but being realistic, if he does move it will be to Italy not France. The French league is not competitive enough and that would not interest him. he will not go to Utd either.
Since he has been in the UK he has lifted the standard of play in the Premier and all the teams now strive to attain a better football standard than previous years. I will not enjoy the day he does go but Managers do move on when they feel they have done enough and being the new City I think they have the replacement all lined up.This season and next for City/Pep7th October 2019 at 11:01 pm #49735
I think these days there are a lot of factors. One of them in which whether there’s a mutual desire for both the Club and a Manager to deliver such length of service.
Ferguson and Wenger were one-offs. It’s highly unlikely this will ever be repeated with the industry being a fast-changing one.
I alluded from my earlier point today there’s a shelf-life for Managers. As far as sustaining Top level, full-marks and my own hat off to both David Silva and Sergio Aguero. 1 or so year short of serving a Decade at Manchester City and still delivering high quality.
I wish for this in Sadio Mane, Mo Salah and Van Dijk. You need continuity and to be able to sustain in being at Top Level.
This is where Manchester United for me have fallen short and are of have already lost sight. in this 6 years, there’s been a lot of change, maybe far too much change. Who is now the longest serving player there? David De Gea?
You have to have a Fulcrum or a Core to build around and add new strands. And you need to allow time and patience too.
A fair Term to give to a Manager is 6 years. You need more than one Transfer Window to build a squad and generate continuity. On the other end of the Spectrum, if you feel you’ve taken the club as far as you can, then you have to pull the plug and admit enough is enough.7th October 2019 at 11:16 pm #49737AnonymousInactive366 pts
LD, cheers for that and honestly it’s a bit shocking to learn that they never went head to head.. I would have bet money that they did but luckily just words this time 😉
It does slightly weaken my position, as Klopp beating Pep from a lower position does obviously sound a lot better. Klopp still beat his predecessor though. No easy task any time.
I guess we’ve got to wait for our answer. I think Klopp could have purchased this summer and also the same for City. Money problems can be worked out to a degree but I feel that both managers refused to push for that extra player. So far it’s showing Klopp in a positive light but that can change and it will change , as the season goes.
I think that looking at our side, we’d mostly feel the loss of Fabinho and Mane. That will surprise the tits off most here but in a short enough absence, we’d have cover for Van Dijk. we’d also have ok cover for Salah and Firmino, although an extended time out would be a disaster.
We have no cover for Fabinho or mane though. I say Mane because he’s almost always working to a high level. He’s always creating problems for the oppositions defence. I don’t get the same feeling from Salah, who gets marked out of the game too often. That might sound silly, given his ability to destroy defences but if you watched every game,. you’d know.
Ultimately, it might just be the squads capability to deal with bad luck that gets either team over the line though. I think every man and their dog would have considered Man City to have the superior squad but we have a tendency to focus on the attacks a little too much… and citys poor strength in depth at the back is being cruelly punished, currently.
Maybe soon it’ll be Liverpool lack of cover in the areas I’ve said… anyway meh bed time.8th October 2019 at 3:39 pm #497828th October 2019 at 3:47 pm #49784
Mac….a good read that I think Pep just thought he could get that bit more out of his defensive players but it has not worked out. The current thinking is to employ Walker there, I think that would be the biggest disaster of all, he does not read a game well as a CB in the Pep mould. We have some problems that have been hoisted on to us, these things happen and as you say it could happen to others as well. City will improve, I feel sure about that. Liverpool are going very well and are in prime spot again but still a way to go yet8th October 2019 at 7:12 pm #49798
Thanks Brian.8th October 2019 at 9:25 pm #498058th October 2019 at 9:55 pm #49809AnonymousInactive366 pts
Brian, I don’t have as good an opinion of Walker as most I think. He doesn’t seem to be a very smart guy. i think you’ve got to be an intelligent person to do well at CB but you know what moving him into that position does? It gets Fernandinho back where he can be effective. I think it’s worth the trade-off because a lot less is getting near that back line with him there.
As for Liverpool if they lost Fabinho. It might be a similar situation. You want that dedicated player available in that role. I do wonder though if Matip might be the best choice to cover for Fabinho. He’s so good on the ball and I wonder if that’s part of the reason as to why Gomez isn’t in the team. That isn’t to say that Gomez is bad on the ball. For a CB, he’s fantastic on it but Matip for me is good enough to be a midfielder. We tend to lack penetration from midfield but then we have our entire defence, who are all ball players. Van Dijk’s passing was a game changer for us. The 2 lads out wide, well… everyone knows but Matip who just got PFA Player of the Month, he will actually charge with the ball, right at the opposition. The guy is fearless.
BTW, props to the PFA for actually recognizing a lower tier Liverpool player for POTM. The lower profile lads often get overlooked, so I was very pleasantly surprised to see him awarded it.
Totally deserved in my mind. He almost single-handedly kept Chelsea at bay. That was a 9/10 performance (I don’t give 10s).
Brian, i think you spoke about Kompany on the other page. I will wade into that since this already touched on it previously. I don’t think it’s Kompany as such that is missed but a replacement. Obviously you want someone who can play most games, to his level (or as close as you can get)… Ultimately you just want to avoid taking potentially your star performer out of his specialised role in order to accommodate an injury. It’s almost like getting 2 injuries then because you take a guy who’s one of the best around in his role… and you put him into a square hole.
I don’t really see Pep making many mistakes but this for me is one. He’ll get it right tho, unfortunately.9th October 2019 at 10:26 am #49827
Mac…well we agree about Walker, I hope Pep puts Garcia in but I doubt it. You are also right about Fernandinho, he is doing a job and no more when he should be used for what he does best. Peps choices are limited but he may need to change his tactics until we are in a stronger personnel position. Kompany..again your thinking right but I was referring more to the steady comments on we were missing him. We are missing a player like him, but Kompany, as we knew him, is in the past. I am no longer convinced that Stones will make it….too many injuries, we need stability at the back.
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