4th October 2019 at 2:12 pm #49267steveosnakeeyeParticipant260 pts4th October 2019 at 5:50 pm #49286The OracleParticipant5 pts
VAR is fine, the way humans interpret it leaves a lot to be desired. What worries me is officials now know they have a get out of jail card when they mess up. Can’t see Harry Maguire standing in front of you playing Abameyang onside by 3 yards so you put your flag up because it’s at Old Trafford. VAR corrected the error and the correct decision is given7th October 2019 at 9:10 am #49651AnonymousInactive11 pts
VAR has opened up more can of worms. Mane went down easily, but there was contact, yet about a month ago Martial was was being held by a player, which resulted in him losing his balance before just before he took his shot and that was deemed not enough contact for him to go down. Dermot Gallagher was saying the Martial incident was correct by the ref, but a few are saying the Mane incident was correct too. So what is deemed not enough contact because if you compare the 2, there was a lot more contact in the Martial incident in comparison to the Mane incident?7th October 2019 at 9:26 am #49654
cm,I’m not singling anyone out here because we all have them but the game needs retrospective bans for diving judged on a Monday until we get that players will continue to dive.
Implement that and within 6 months diving would be almost eliminated.
VAR imo would never have turned the Mane penalty down because it would have made the Ref look bad but equally had it not been given by the Ref and been the subject of a VAR review I doubt it would have been given.
The problem with VAR is that offsides aside which are pretty specific if not currently a bit too pedantic with centimetre offside decisions it’s still just down to the human judgement of the Video Referee.7th October 2019 at 9:39 am #49656AnonymousInactive11 pts
Agree with you Nine. One issue I have had with that 1 offside call last Monday was the linesman putting his flag up when he did. It was a obvious error my linesman and Aubameyang was clearly onside, the linesman should have waited till the ball was in the back of the net before doing so. Thats how it was done during the previous world cup. A few United players saw the flag and stopped running.
Not saying it would have made a difference, yet in a different game and different situation where the player could have tracked back and blocked the shot, yet he didn’t because he thought the player was offside due to the linesman flag, it would make a difference. This is 1 of the areas where VAR is clearly not working.7th October 2019 at 9:53 am #49659
cm, I agree mate the linesman got that wrong but should we blame VAR for his error ?
Robot Linesmen pre programmed and that problems solved.?7th October 2019 at 11:20 am #49666sean the sailorParticipant425 pts
Agree cm. It’s inconsistent calls. Look at the shirt pulling at set plays. It’s still going on and city and Liverpool have had clear pens not given recently.
Saw the material incident and it was a pen7th October 2019 at 12:11 pm #49673MikusParticipant211 pts
For me, the refs have got to start using the pitch side monitor to check their decision themselves so there’s no damage done to their integrity if they then change the decision. At the moment, the VAR ref does not want to disrespect the on pitch ref so they hide behind the “clear and obvious” line so relieve them from having to overturn a decision.20th October 2019 at 3:47 pm #50499Chelsea.manParticipant139 pts
VAR seems to be worsening by the day. more errors that it was supposed to solve exist. i think it’s high time that people are trained who are independent from the current set up.20th October 2019 at 4:03 pm #50503
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again it’s not VAR at fault it’s human error.20th October 2019 at 4:04 pm #50504PaganParticipant370 pts
CM, personally I think the best solution would be to just ditch it, but that isn’t going to happen unfortunately.
What we need is consistency, ideally across the league but firstly in each individual game.
So for individual games, all decisions that are reviewed to be reviewed pitch side by the ref, he and he alone should decide if he wants to review a decision he has given, an independent ref to tell him to review something he has not seen as opposed to not given (off the ball incidents) Goals to still be reviewed if the ref wants to, and offsides to be reviewed for a clear and obvious error, not the stupid margins that we see now that cannot be done to that accuracy as it’s only a guess when the ball has started to move forward.
….Pagan20th October 2019 at 11:48 pm #50603
VAR isn’t the problem. It’s the people behind it.
Mane’s goal in slow motion actually shows he chests the ball down into his path.
And Origi was fouled.
On top of that, Martin Atkinson was the Ref lol – so it couldn’t turn out Sweeter!21st October 2019 at 5:56 am #50604threepsParticipant171 pts
Nil you are not wrong regarding the people behind VAR, that is where the problem lies. I read somewhere that the VAR assistant refs are actual refs belonging to the same organisation as the match officials. The problem is, they are not Premier League refs as there are not enough to be spared. So you have these lesser ranked refs having to make decisions against their superior colleagues which I believe they are too scared to contradict them. I’m not just talking about yesterdays game Utd vs Liverpool, there’s been many occasions this season when even as a neutral you are left shaking your head as a clear and obvious error fails to be overturned. (not seen all the games this weekend but heard there were a fair few contentious decisions!)
A couple of interesting quotes coming from the Utd Liverpool game:
‘Firstly, the on-field referee didn’t think it was a foul and VAR checked/decided that it wasn’t a clear and obvious error to not award the foul,’ the PGMOL told Sky Sports. ‘Secondly, VAR isn’t re-refereeing matches, there is contact but VAR was comfortable it wasn’t enough to disallow the goal.’
Klopp said: ‘Mr Atkinson let the game run I’m sure because there is VAR. For me it was a clear foul.’
Are VAR and the refs leaving it to each other to make decisions?21st October 2019 at 9:49 am #50617
3ps, that’s it. Completely agree.
I’d like somebody either ‘neutral’ to review VAR or the Match Ref himself to make him realise well actually, he got it wrong.
There’s a correlation though with this and the Home team getting decisions their own way.21st October 2019 at 12:57 pm #50648
threeps, maybe the VAR Referee should be named just like the match Referee is named.
I agree there needs to be a quality Referee as the VAR.
When I’ve heard certain decisions refered to re VAR on TV it’s been said for instance that Andre Mariner is the VAR but you’re right there just can’t be enough top Referee’s to referee the games and to be the VAR at the same time x the number of PL games. Although yesterday for the United v Liverpool game I suspect it was a recognised Referee as the VAR as it was the only game going on.
The clear and obvious error always gives the VAR the get out and they are reluctant to overturn the match Referee’s decisions that’s what happend with the Origi incident imo and Origi’s exaggeration probably worked against the VAR giving that decision.
I understand there’s a big meeting in Europe this week to review VAR and how it’s working across all football and something might come out of that.
ps I thought it was a foul.?
21st October 2019 at 1:02 pm #50650
- This reply was modified 7 months, 2 weeks ago by nine nine nine.
……..VAR clearly showed that the ball hit Mane’s hand so the goal was quite rightly ruled out.
21st October 2019 at 1:14 pm #50653threepsParticipant171 pts
- This reply was modified 7 months, 2 weeks ago by nine nine nine.
“Although yesterday for the United v Liverpool game I suspect it was a recognised Referee as the VAR as it was the only game going on.”
It was David Coote assisted by Marc Perry.
Nope, I haven’t either.
VAR worked for Mane’s goal, whether the rules are right or not is a whole other debate…
21st October 2019 at 1:35 pm #50656
- This reply was modified 7 months, 2 weeks ago by threeps.
threeps, I’m surprised at that, David Coote is certainly not one of our most experienced Referee’s with just 3 PL games reffed this season to be selected as the VAR for such a big game I would have expected a much more experirnced Referee as the VAR and given that it was the only game that shouldn’t have been a problem.
Like you I’m really unsure about goals being ruled out for accidental handball but yesterday although it was purely accidental I think the accidental handball was a major contributory factor to Mane scoring the goal because it helped him control the ball prior to scoring and perhaps that’s the problem which has led to all accidental hand ball goals being ruled out.
It was definitely accidental handball though by Mane and the nonsensical part is that had the same thing happened to Lindelof it would have been a penalty.21st October 2019 at 5:23 pm #50676
I saw one angle that shows Mane chest the ball down. May I need to see more than one angle.
Even the tiniest of touches though, its penalized.
Not a problem if there is consistency in this going forward.⚽️21st October 2019 at 6:18 pm #50683PaganParticipant370 pts
9s, you had a very experienced ref, he was the one running round in the middle blowing his whistle, or not as the case may be, he should have watched it himself and decided if he was happy with his initial decision….Pagan
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