[Pagan]

Yord, The derby fans are fine, and I’m going with some of the Millwall lot, they’re 60ish now so we’re around in the 70s and 80s so they have plenty of tales to tell

Other than Derby I go and see Notts, Forest, Leicester, reasonably local to me. If I’m away anywhere I try to take in a long al game….Pagan

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[Pagan]

9, there’s the problem, you only retrospectively look at offside after a goal to see if it should stand, if you get flagged incorrectly for offside (when you feel you are actually onside) do you ignore the refs whistle and try and put the ball in the net as that’s the only way you can get it reviewed. No more “play to the whistle” instructions.

Other than that the advantage always goes to the defending team, which is at odds to the changes to the offside law which has been changed to the advantage to the attackin team.

Rugby as you know has a signal for I have seen a potential offence and I am waiting to see if there is an advantage, that wait in rugby can be a considerable time before play is bought back should it be necessary. Football doesn’t have that signal, it has an advantage play on which is seconds after the offence and cannot be bought back should the advantage not materialise.

In order for video reffing to be fair to both teams football will have to have the same system as rugby where time is given to see what happens should a refs assistant raise his flag. What will in effect happen is the assistant will only flag when the player is miles offside and then leave everything to the video ref.

….Well that’s how I see it…..Pagan

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[Pagan]

9, offside is another contentious one, the video refs chalk off a goal if the player scores and was then found to be offside, what happens when the officials stop the game for offside when it isn’t? It would seem that it will only benefit the defending team in that instance, where the offside law has been tweaked to give the advantage to the attacking team.

Personally I don’t like the idea at all…..Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chelsea.man, there’s so many things that can happen that make video reffing unworkable, the ref misses an incident where a players makes a dangerous tackle, the ball doesn’t go out of play, and the next time there is a stoppage is when a team scores a goal, then what do you do, especially if the offending player scores that goal. It would all get to complicated, for what should be a simple game…Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chelsea.man, good in theory, but you then turn a 90min game into 2 hours plus

If the ref misses an incident, when does that get reviewed as there’s no stoppage in play at the time.

I personally don’t want any video reffing during the game as it will make it too sterile, and we lose all talking points and debate.

However I think we need retrospective action to weed out the cheats

…Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chuckles, you’re right, I think he’d get a standing ovation from the people there at the time, then the FA would ban him….Pagan

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[Pagan]

My lad refs, when he comes off we usually have a chat about the game and any decisions he makes, the question I alway ask is what did you see when……

His answer always ties in with the action he took, which although if seen from a different angle he may have done something else.

I personally would like to see refs asked the same question after games, this needs to be done without tv replays and it turning into a witch hunt, and we may get to see the rationale behind their decisions….Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chuckles, that applies to all the sports we invent, I think the only thing we’re good at at the moment is binge drinking….Pagan

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[Pagan]

NB, totally untrue, ‘twas the late 70s against India I believe, but look how it was dealt with, not the namby pamby way football does things…Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chuckles, sport is like music, Tribute bands may actually play the songs better, but the real skill is in the creation of the song….Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chuckles, a “ne now” is a a badly spelled “one now”

What’s a Pagen??

….Pagan

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[Pagan]

The other thing that needs looking at is the Olivier effect, the rolling round on the floor as if fatally wounded often holding a part of the body different to the part that was brushed against by that mean player from the other team.

However the flip side to that coin is the Terry Butcher effect, where the letting of blood overrides the pain threshold and allows the warrior within the player to manifest itself

….Pagan

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Well you’ve met a ne now NB, but then again I play and coach cricket, which still hasn’t yet succumbed to the win at all costs mentality….Pagan

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[Pagan]

So to sum up this thread,

Diving/exaggeration is wrong needs to stop
it’s justifiable for your own team to do it as other teams do it
Retrospective action is inconsistent so not a deterrent
The rewards for cheating outweigh the punishments

Result – we have to accept it as part of the game

….Pagan

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[Pagan]

9, I would agree it needs to be the same panel, but Stevie Wonder must have been one of them that was involved in the Gray case…Pagan

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[Pagan]

9, you’re right and I know it won’t happen, so diving/exaggeration has to be accepted as part of the game, and as such will be coached and rewarded.

The benefits of promotion from the championship to the prem is estimated as £170m, what kind of a punishment can you put against that?

The only way I can see is to make it sociably unacceptable by attaching shame to it, but obviously we can’t do that as it may upset the perpetrators and violate their human rights.

…Pagan

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[Pagan]

999, so the cheats win? what is the cost of relegation? The cost of missing out on promotion, The cost or reward for being/not being in the CL, ultimately that could be the cost to a team, compare that to a player not being available for a game or two if three people can’t agree on something, let’s face it the Gray decision doesn’t fill you full of confidence.

Hand on heart, do you think the clubs encourage diving/exaggeration

Do you think it’s coached into players to exaggerate the merest contact to deceive the officials

Do you think Gray got a pat on the back after the game?

Treat the symptom, not the cause, make it unacceptable to cheat….Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chuckles, and that’s why we have a problem, justifying diving/exaggeration by saying it’s ok as another player is doing it…..Pagan

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[Pagan]

Paxton, not enough of a punishment there, you get three point for a win that comes from a dive, you go back to one point which was as you were before the incident.

The club is responsible for the conduct of its players, it’s also responsible for the coaching of its players. I would suggest the team gets punished, but I would go for -2 points for the first offence, -4 for the next and so on. Make the punishment outweigh potential gains….Pagan

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[Pagan]

Chuckles, it’s an epidemic in pro football, but when you see it creeping into kids football it’s really quite worrying, I’ve seen it at under 11 and 12, and more worryingly in girls football…..Pagan

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