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It’s dysfunctional from top to bottom lads
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This thing about guile in midfield is a red herring.
The Liverpool team that won the lot was made up from a combination of Fabinho, Milner, Henderson and Winjaldum in midfield.
A fit, hardworking midfield that did the basics very well, worked hard for each other, knew their roles well but most importantly played within a coherent plan.No guile there but have a box full of medals.
People are STILL fixated on personnel and still cant see the bigger picture.
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Writz is supposed to be the magcian but the tactics are absolutely destroying him.
The problem is how we are set up etc. isak will struggle badly if slot stays on. Look at macca, grav and a good few more. Tactics killing them
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Agree with all of that Ginger. Those achievements all fair and square in my eyes and proudness.
Guile from an innocent point of view is skill flair, and being smart with tricks. Fowler and Steve McManaman in their early hey days were brilliant as Dual.
The other side of Guile I tend to perceive beyond innocent grit is those players with a little bit more cunningness about them and ones that stretch the boundaries. I always think back to the England National Team and possible reasons as to why they’ve never won anything since 1966. Would the ‘3 Lions British Bulldog’ Spirit be enough or did they need to have had an Edge about them and cunningness?
Maybe this was ultimately what PSG had over us, all along: An Edge and Cunningness beyond being a well-drilled team and with a Top Quality Finisher like Dembele.
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So when speaking about Tactics, are we highlighting the possibility of the instructions laid out from Arne Slot?
Wirtz does well for his National Team just recently and I am seeing somebody who has upped his gears to another level.
He is Capable for example in striking a ball and finding the net but we haven’t seen this as much whilst in Liverpool Colours.
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This thing about guile in midfield is a red herring.
It definitely wasn’t a red herring last night as Vitinha bossed the midfield and produced yet another masterclass, would have been worse if Fabian Ruiz was available.
Read my post, I quite clearly said we need to have another creative option in midfield, who can can be a controller the midfield, and keep the ball – Did you see how many times Gravenberch and Szoboszlai cheaply gave the ball away last night, couldn’t even complete a simple short pass?
I personally, would 100% welcome just one top midfielder controller, inthe mould of Bernado Silva or Vitinha, to complement our midfield, to control the tempo and keep the ball.
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“Interesting thoughts Song, and follow your sentiments. I heard on the phone in last night about a point made of GUILE. The players who I would perceive to have guile we no longer have such as Luis Diaz and Trent A Arnold.”
Correct, the question is why did Richard Hughes sell Diaz, yet Slot wanted him to stay? And even worse, not replace him with a similar quality winger?
In fact, all the commentators on Amazon last night were raving about Vitinha, and PSG’s midfield, stating how much better it was than ours.
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70 million for a 28 year old player with one year left on his contract. They wanted the money and the reason we did not sign a winger is Rio, Hughes did not want block any amount of game time for him.
I find it crazy we gave Gakpo a 250k contract and sold Diaz.
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“It definitely wasn’t a red herring last night”
You’ve completely missed the point…..yet again.
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Gakpo looked good and fresh last night. Everyone else looks shattered or injured
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And I have not been a fan this year of Gakpo. He has been horribly over played
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I appreciate where you are coming from Song; That’s more to do with level of Authority and Decision-making. Those particular Roles above the Head Coach you would presume sanctioned those Sales of players and purchases of the ones recruited last Summer.
Obviously this is hindsight and part of me now feels we could have made better use of those funds.
Fundamentally, should there be change of Management or ‘Head Coach’ this coming Summer, they going to want to examine the Terms and Conditions and arguably going to want authority and control on Player comings and goings. I suspect in reality ultimately, that’s unlikely or there’s always some ‘backward and forward’.
I’m reading and believing more into Arne already consolidating his future and ending to his Tenure agreed as of end of season.
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Nil Slot is and was a short term yes man, we got another huge window ahead of us and according to recent reports neither Edward’s or Hughes are here for the long term.
It would not surprise me to see Hughes heading somewhere else after the summer and then Edward’s the year after.
I doubt any of them have a long term future at the club.
All of our players on loan will be sold, I think Endo needs to retire basically as well. Then Gomez, Mac, maybe Gravy will be sold. Perhaps Gakpo as well if we find a club for him. Alison is likely to leave as well.
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Absolutely Sean. Could only imagine Wirtz’s impact if he’d moved to either Bayern, PSG, Barca or Madrid.
Freedom to express surrounded by world class players.
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Bingo, that sounds like another phase of a squad rebuild which in reality is where we are. I’m all for voting on change of Leadership where it matters.
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Song, absolutely, we are crying out for more quality in mid (defensive mid would be my priority) but any workforce is only as good/efficient as the environment that is provided.
Extrinsic motivation harnessed by intrinsic.
The system, the coaching, the tactics.
All the opposite of what we experienced under Klopp.
A clear plan, clear tactics and a clear team ID.
The players are fucked physically and mentally. We’re ponderous. No clear game plan. Relying on moments as opposed to structured, organised phases of play. We’re shagged out after 70 mins. We concede, we crumble. Individual not collective decision making. Dropped points against shite. A plethora of last minute goals against us. My good friend Mark at the Academy indirectly intimating to me at Christmas that’s ‘it’s different’ with no enthused explanation, meaning it’s not what it should be.
It’s a fucking mess.
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Rob gets it.
It’s not about the personnel here.
We’ve seen worse Liverpool teams play better/more coherently than this team that’s littered with talent.
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John Barnes in 2020 when we had that midfield of Henderson, Gini and Fabinho.
“Everyone says Liverpool’s midfield needs more creativity and goals…
looking at the league table, I’d say everyone else needs more work-rate.”“It’s not a question of scoring more goals from midfield… it’s about being stronger in midfield.”
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Ginger, just been texting my good mate Tim who I was in the Leppings Lane end with on that horrific day and we talked about that team, that day. We did have top players (we do now) but it also contained the likes of Gary Ablett (God bless his soul), Staunton, Houghton, Venison but Dalglish created ‘that environment’ of a game plan, tactics, pride, self belief. (Sir) Bob and Klopp did that too.
We beat Forest just three weeks later and then Everton in the Final. We did THAT after what WE went through just weeks prior.
This team wouldn’t have made that Final.
Environment.
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I don’t think anybody’s been blinded by that summation Rob of which I agree with largely. Player Tragic Death affecting the environment (to add).
It’s lots of different matters and reasons
Ultimately with that in mind though, we’ve struggled with the fundamental basics and all the other points you’ve rightly outlined.
And Every Supporter in their minds I’m sure realise all this. We’re just now hoping for some kind of a ‘silver lining’ with these remaining 6 matches that could either get us in the CL, the Europa or completely out of everything in which case an entire season without European Football going into the next campaign.
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